Why do we keep punishing Jesus?

Jesus was hung on a cross for humanity’s sins. We know he was crucified because we have proof now, but the ‘why’ of this is up for interpretation. Christian folk have been taught that he was an innocent man tortured to save each of us, condemned for no reason but that he spoke out against the Roman dictatorship over the Jewish people, and the churches dictatorship over its own people. Oh yes, he broke a few tables along the way, but he never broke any ‘heads’, so he was calmer and quieter than some of the rabble who called themselves God’s representatives at the time. His message was one of love, peace and forgiveness – but that got lost along the way when the writer of Revelation turned him into the Vengeful Messiah the Jewish folk were craving .. sorry, the Christian folk were craving, after they converted.

Two thousand years later how much has changed? There are still people selling holy relics in the churches, only we call them music CDs and meditation tapes these days (or bits of the stone wall, imported direct from Mecca). Money still changes hands to buy redemption .. only now it’s called ‘give to the churches favourite charity’ (itself?). And our behaviour hasn’t improved, even after all this time, and all the sermons (or lectures) delivered from various pulpits. The Ten Commandments are still being ignored by most people, who go ahead and lust, steal and murder whenever it suits them. How many of them do you think care what God or Jesus will actually do to them after they die? Oh no, they’ve already turned their backs on that belief system .. and even if they haven’t .. the good Christians are murdering the commandments day by day.

I don’t really want to debate the commandments today, even though I think we should all put some serious consideration into re-inventing them. It’s not that they aren’t important, it’s that some of them don’t make sense anymore, given what Jesus taught us about God, and then there’s ‘honouring your parents’ which may end in you being abused by one, or both, of them. So let me get back to the point …

I was listening to Christian radio the other day, happily agreeing with what most of the speaker was saying, until something he said made me realise that we are constantly punishing Jesus. When we choose to sin we are deliberately denying everything he did for us by being hung up on that Cross. The teachings of the church, particularly when I was a child, was that each of us is born into sin .. the sins of our ‘fathers’ (does that make our mother’s relieved?) .. which actually means ‘the sins of our parents’. I have to ask why God would create beings that carried this sin for generation to generation (40 in all?) and how we escape it .. how about the 41st generation .. but no, the sin continues onto and into forever, and we can never be free of it, unless we accept Jesus as our Lord and Saviour .. (strange how we are lumbered with sin, but not allowed to benefit from the acceptance of our parent’s heartfelt connection back to God. When does the poison stop spreading through humanity’s veins .. and sin is a poison. It does make us ill). So I accept Jesus as my Lord and Saviour and therefore I am rescued from sin .. in that moment. Ten minutes later I go outside, covet someone’s car or bus or bike, or wife (heaven forbid because I’m female .. and my husband would object :-)) and I am back to being a sinner again.

So I turn myself around, go back into the church, and if it’s appropriate, confess this sin, say the Hail Mary’s or various other prayers we all use to ask for forgiveness and everything is all right again .. until I go outside and, walking home, ‘borrow’ a lemon from the fruit tree down the road (and the sin is not mitigated by making lemon cake and giving the owner half), without asking the owner first. Whoops, there goes sin number eight. Or worse, I tap the statue of Mother Mary on the knee on the way out the door and thank her for everything she’s helped me with (all those prayers) and there’s sin number two, because all thanks should be to God, or so I am taught. And what about if I have to work a shift or two on Sunday .. do I spent Monday on my knees begging forgiveness, not just for that one day, but because I am a repeat sinner. Is the punishment worse if we consciously sin over and over again?

Dear Jesus, who removed the sins of the world (John 1:29) .. turns out you only gave us the grace to turn around and break the rules again. And if you did remove ‘the sins of the world’ why is it that the Christians think you only did it for them?

There are times that I stand outside the Christian faith looking in and wonder what God will truly do to all those hypocrites, liars, cheats and thieves, and that’s just among the clergy. If they are not good enough Christians, and I am only a lay Theologian, what hope is there for me, if I follow their leadership? The church set themselves up as the role model for humanity .. and yet the law is now chasing various churches for not producing their paedophiles on demand, for covering up thousands of cases of abuse, and convincing the innocent that they would be publicly vilified if they tell anyone that a priest was their abuser. And where is Jesus in all this .. still hung up on the cross, because he really needs to stay there otherwise we have no hope at all.

For all the agony that he suffered for us in those three hours or so he was crucified, we have given him two and half million+ hours more through our own thoughts and actions. When do you think it will be enough, and he can come down off the cross and help us to be the people we can be, through his example .. loving, kind, generous, forgiving, tolerant, peaceful, thoughtful, God filled? Sometime soon I hope.

In a world full of fear and hatred being a God-filled person and trying to ‘lead by example’ can be incredibly difficult, but that is no excuse for not trying. Jesus was a human being just like you and me. He put his life on the line for us, as a living example of what we can achieve, with a little determination, a touch of temper and a strong desire to change the world. He started small. Look at the society God chose to drop him into, and the challenges of no ‘mass communication’, apart from anything else. Word of mouth was the best form of advertising then, and it still is. Leading by example still gathers hearts and souls together. Now we have the internet, and tv and movies, and what do we produce .. more programs to create horror and fear .. just look at the nightly news and their focus on disasters ..

But then, I am getting off the topic again ..

When Jesus saved us he knew we were sinners and that we needed a representative between us and God, and so he put himself there, human fears and all. Can we make ourselves a representative who stands up for what Jesus believes in, although society might ignore us or laugh and make fun? Can we ask him to come down off that cross for each of us now? You see, when Jesus was alive, there was no Christianity, there was only God. Jesus was not Christian, he was not exclusive, or inclusive, he wanted to talk to everyone about his Creator. The Christian church is closing its door on its own reality right now, because it is run by sinners seeking Revelationianic outcomes, rather than the truly loving ones that Jesus taught us about. Because .. when you think about it for a moment .. you will realise that, if Vengeful Messiah ‘came’ now, heaven would be very empty, and most of us would be in hell, suffering with the demons. Where would you be?

Love & Peace
Ama

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When is Wrath not Wrath?

Just this morning a friend and I, were discussing various biblical topics, and got onto the Wrath of God and what it actually is? I pulled out the dictionary, given my very questioning turn of mind, and found –

Wrath –

1. Forceful, often vindictive anger.
2. a. Punishment or vengeance as a manifestation of anger.
b. Divine retribution for sin.
1. angry, violent, or stern indignation
2. divine vengeance or retribution
3. Archaic a fit of anger or an act resulting from anger

So I shared those definitions with her .. and she grumbled ‘Ama, don’t be so literal!’ .. but how can I not be? If the Bible is our only authority on God, how can we not take it literally? Here I will add my usual grumble .. it’s supposed to be without error, addition or editing .. not true, of course, but .. let’s just take it literally for a while.

Ok, so the definition seems pretty clear to me. Wrath means unbridled and destructive anger. And then something on that Free Dictionary page reminded me that Wrath, or wroth, is a deadly sin. Oh heck? Does that mean God sins? Either that or ‘he’s’ a hypocrite, saying one thing and doing another? Neither fits well with the NT God who teaches ‘Love one another as I have loved you’, but we know the OT one can get mighty angry.

So I went into Strong’s Concordance hunting wrath. There’s plenty in the OT .. and quite a few in the NT .. but then I noticed, book by book, that some of the Strong’s wraths are now translated mostly as ‘anger’ .. so let’s eliminate them. And, just for the sake of argument, let’s also eliminate what other people said of what either Jesus or God said, which left us with the four gospels. Now I’m doing that because our true source of what God is comes to us through Jesus Christ. The rest is other people’s interpretations. And what is in the gospels .. two comments about John the Baptist, in Matthew and Luke, which, while not contradicting each other, do define a group of Pharisees and Sadducees (Matthew 3:7) as only a crowd of people (Luke 3:7), so whom do we believe there? I would have thought that Luke would delight in naming those converts to John’s God? But I am getting off topic, or not really, given John’s temper. 🙂

Where was I? Oh yes, Luke 21:23 “Woe to those who are pregnant and to those who are nursing infants in those days! For there will be great distress on the earth and wrath against this people …”. My question had to be ‘which people’? In the passage Jesus is talking directly to his followers of their lives after his death. And the time of wrath will see ‘Jerusalem surrounded by armies and destroyed’. And given Jerusalem’s history, I think that time has past, or is history going to repeat itself? I wonder if He thought He was thinking about 2000 years in the future, or simply looking around Him knowing the society as He did? We can only speculate.

John 3:36 “Whoever believes in the Son has eternal life; whoever disobeys the Son will not see life, but must endure God’s wrath”. What did the Son actually say “love one another as I have loved you” and “obey the laws” .. and along came Paul, and various others, and shot it all down. Who do you want to believe? Personally, since He’s God’s son, I’d go with Jesus, but the Christian church now follows Paul .. so is God’s wrath going to land on Paul’s followers .. and they are Paul’s followers since they are ignoring Jesus words, unless it suits them to do otherwise.

And that’s all the wrath I can pin down in the NT. Oh yes, I did find one thing though .. can’t help being fascinated and taking notes .. 🙂

Paul in Romans 12:19 “Beloved, never avenge yourselves, but leave room for the wrath of God, for it is written ‘Vengeance is mine, I will repay, says the Lord’.”

Then in Romans 13:4 we have “It is for the servant of God (those who act for the authorities) to execute wrath on the wrongdoer.”

I am a bit confused. 🙂 First we are not allowed to act in wrath, and then we are supposed to .. or is wrath and vengeance two different things? Technically yes, since the first is the anger and second is the act, but we are not supposed to act in anger, so does a person seek vengeance in cold blood instead? But wait ..

Attributed to Paul, but generally agreed not actually written by him:

Ephesians 4:31 “Put away from you all bitterness and wrath and anger and wrangling and slander, together with all malice, and be kind to one another, tenderhearted, forgiving one another, as God in Christ has forgiven you.” And it continues in Ephesians 5:1 “Therefore be imitators of God, as beloved children, and live in love, as Christ loved us and gave himself up for us, a fragrant offering and sacrifice to God.” Lovely words, very un-Paul-like.

So who is this God of the NT, whose Son spoke only once about Wrath, perhaps referring to the murder of the first born sons of Egypt .. since it reminds me of that? Jesus Christ spoke of love, not hatred, of peace and not war .. and the smiting had stopped. Unless I am mistaken no one has died by God’s hand since Jesus came into the world, and even before that.

Do we have to fear God’s wrath since Jesus came? Well, if you live in Revelation you do, but if you see it as it is, a commentary on Christian persecution in the time of Nero, I don’t think so .. but that is only my opinion. I side with Jesus in the fact that God loves all of His Children, and a loving person might correct his children, but he doesn’t let wrath guide his hand.

Love & Peace
Ama

Law – has heaven and earth passed away

Ok, now here’s a curious thought. The foundation of the Faith, Judaism, states that all Jewish people had certain laws they had to follow. It’s a long list, including laws on what could and couldn’t be eaten. Those laws transferred themselves (well, not literally, but you know what I mean) into the Old Testament (OT), and from that foundation expanded into the New Testament (NT), but somewhere along the way – the laws stopped applying, or did they? What was the criteria for them to be no longer valid for people who worshipped God?

In the NT (Matthew 5:17-18) Jesus said: “Do not think that I have come to abolish the law or the prophets; I have come not to abolish but to fulfil. For truly I tell you, until heaven and earth pass away, not one letter, not one stroke of a letter, will pass from the law until all is accomplished.” Later he says that heaven and earth ‘will’ pass away (Matthew 24:35), but he doesn’t mention exactly when; no, that’s left to the writer of Revelation (John?) to say that it hasn’t happened yet, among others, and won’t until Jesus comes again .. so why is it that Christians are no longer ‘under the law’?

Of course, I tried this question on the Christian person I mentioned in the other post, in a polite fashion, and s/he focused on fulfilment being the crucificion/resurrection, and completely ignored the fact that ‘heaven and earth’ had not gone yet, even when asked ‘clearly’ twice, so you’ll have to settle for my opinion.

Let me get pedantic, and literal, as the fundamentalists demand that we be, when reading the Bible. If the whole book is the unerring Word of God, and there are no errors or omissions, no bits added or deleted, or rewritten, and its very easy to understand – then the words spoken by Jesus are exactly what he said, and so, if heaven and earth were not the physical ones, why didn’t he say so at the time? I’ve read the passage, the chapters and everything around them, and tons of notes about the subject, and I cannot find any mention, by Jesus, of us viewing it as a metaphorical statement. He never mentioned it was a parable. And if he didn’t mean it literally, why do we have Revelation stating it has not happened yet, or 2 Peter 3:11 saying we are still waiting for it, which completely contradicts Paul (Romans & Galatians) inferring that it had? Why does it not apply anymore?

A gentleman on a Christian webpage writes very clearly that the Law became a stumbling block.

“This Law, then, by its very nature of coming out of the heart of God, and being spoken to men, is a standard for human conduct, a perfect standard. Because it was perfect, and we are not, it is impossible for sinful people to keep. It was for this reason that the Law became a stumbling block. It became an obstacle to Man because it is an unattainable perfect standard. The Law, then, brings about the opposite of what it requires. The Law says to be perfect, but shows you where you are not. It says to be holy, but condemns you when you are not. Since it is not possible for us to keep the Law and therefore earn our position with God, we then need the holiness of God given to us — because there simply isn’t any way for us to attain to the standard of God.” M.S. (If you would like his URL please contact me, I am more than happy to supply it).

It’s a very good point, and a perfect reason for finding ways to get around it .. but .. then he goes on to point out that because Jesus was perfect, we are made perfect through faith in Him. Lovely. I don’t really want to argue with that, but how does it explain that we have had to buy our way into heaven? Catholic Indulgences Afterall, sometimes being a ‘good’ Christian is simply too hard. But I keep thinking that being saved by Grace .. and oddly, I believe we are .. means that we are letting someone else take responsibility for our behaviour, when we, through our own choices, commit sins (don’t obey the rules), but suddenly I wonder, since the ‘laws’ no longer apply, how can we know what ‘is’ a sin, and what isn’t? The commandments were very clear, but since they no longer apply???, being part of the Law, where does that leave us? Jesus is said to be the one perfect atonement for our sins, but if we choose (and it is a choice) to sin over and over again, is he still going to come along, accept our apology, pat us on the head and says ‘Go your ways, and from now on do not sin again (John 8:11)’. So how many times is enough – just how much of this will God take?

If God’s love is conditional, then when someone does a foolish (its got to be foolish, if not downright stupid, to anger God) action, speaks the wrong words, or has sinful thoughts, they will be sent to hell. If God’s love is unconditional, we only have our own karma to deal with. You know karma – some people call it ’cause and effect’, for every action there is an equal and opposite way to balance/replay it. Of course, you have to believe you have more than one lifetime to do so, depending on your behaviour .. but that’s another article in itself.

So then I drifted back to checking the bible for quotes about heaven and earth passing away, and found Luke, who says “the law and the prophets were in effect until John came; since then the good news of the kingdom of God is proclaimed, and everyone tries to enter it by force” (John 16:16). That seems very specific! So now I am confused. 🙂 It seems John’s (the Baptist?) coming is what stopped the Law applying to Christians, or is it more particularly the Jewish people (and so why is it in the Christian Bible in the NT?), since he died before Jesus was crucified, so he was never Christian.

Please do not tell me this is not a confusing book.

And on a stranger note again – Buying your way into heaven I think I really hope this isn’t true.

Love & Peace
Ama